Mable discussed with Cai Yan, managing director of NGC, the thinking framework she proposed in her recent article "Differences in DeFi Valuation", and put some examples, such as MPH88, SUSHI and ALPHA, into this framework for discussion. The two also talked about the recent COVER incident. Yan Cai shares some of the metrics she likes to look at when evaluating and projecting, and explains her own investment strategy and style. Overall, this podcast is very interesting, and Mable said he enjoyed the chat.